Deep Woods Tea Party: nefaeria: glitter witch: Traditional and Alternative Methods of...
So who is telling you can or can’t do something? I fail to see it in any of the comments. Secondly, someone from a specific culture sharing how to do a sacred ceremony to someone outside of their culture is their choice. Your friends were cool with that, good for you.
There are plenty of our First Peoples who do not like it one bit, especially when new age hipster douches are selling “authentic Indian smudges” out of their stores. From what I understand, smudge bundles are traditionally given away.
Anyhow, at the end of the day you can do what you like, just don’t expect people to be all lovey-dovey and not call shit what it is. You have the right to burn all the smudges you want, and we have the right point out cultural appropriation where we see it. k? thnx, bai.
glitter witch: Traditional and Alternative Methods of Claiming Space
I would say that it is cultural appropriation, Seren. Although I have heard some practitioners of witchcraft claim that burning herb bundles {with a very similar make up to smudge sticks} is a magical practice…
My Native American friends did their smudging with sweet grass and sage. And never had any problem with white people doing it. In fact, they would teach people how.
So stop telling me what I can’t do, kthx.
The comment on whether using the term “smudging” is appropriative or not.
I’m sick of white bitches telling me not to use native things when no native I’ve ever personally known cared.
You heard me.
this actually irritates me. You’re telling me that burning an herb to cleanse my space of negative energies is cultural appropriation? That’s just asinine.
Burning herbs that are sacred to some Native American cultures, and using those herbs because of their properties that come directly from their use in some Native American ceremonies…Yes. That’s cultural appropriation. That’s what I was asking in my original post here - isn’t that cultural appropriation? I asked around elsewhere too, and spoke with some people in the know and the general consensus is that yes, it’s cultural appropriation.
Of course I can’t speak from authority on the matter, and I wouldn’t presume to do so, but I can share a little bit of what I’ve learned about all this. From what I’ve learned, it’s not just about using the herbs, and it’s not just about calling whatever you’re doing “smudging” because that’s what such ceremonies are called in English. From what I’ve learned, not every tribe “smudges,” and for those who do, it’s not necessarily done in the exact same way from one tribe to the next. But where “smudging” is done (I’m also told that some people find that term offensive in itself), it’s performed in certain situations and certain circumstances, by certain people, within a specific worldview and context. Not everyone has a right to those ceremonies, so to say that “my Native friends said it’s OK!” doesn’t mean much if they don’t have the kind of knowledge or understanding to speak from. At the end of the day, as much as some might say it’s OK - even assuming they come from a people who hold these things sacred - others say it’s not OK. Others actively campaign against this kind of thing, and those campaigners, I’m told, include people who maintain those ceremonies they are asking outsiders not to appropriate.
I’m also told that the kind of ceremonies that outsiders perform are not likely to be based on any understanding of the ceremonies they try to mimic - aside from “white sage and sweetgrass are herbs of purification!” “Do this at it will remove bad energy and banish bad spirits!” Which doesn’t even begin to cover what the ceremonies are actually about. So I can see why it’s seen as offensive. It’s not even appropriating an actual understanding of the ceremonies that are being mimicked. They are practices that turn what are sacred ceremonies, sacred herbs, sacred beliefs into something that’s twisted and completely missing the point of why these things are done in the first place. That seems a little shallow and sad to me.
People often say you shouldn’t mess with what you don’t understand, which seems like sound advice. I don’t understand why - apparently - that wisdom doesn’t extend to Native ceremonies and beliefs for some people. Unless you’ve experienced those ceremonies for yourself, and have an understanding of what they mean within their cultural context, you’re messing with stuff you have no real understanding of. Fuck up a ceremonial magick ritual and you have the potential for putting yourself in no end of danger or trouble. Is it any different when you fuck up another culture’s rituals instead? Possibly not.
On top of all that, from what I understand there are laws in at least some states in the US against selling items as “Native American” when they are not made by Native Americans. The reasons for that seem sensible enough but an unfortunate side-effect of this law seems to have spawned (or perhaps, more likely, helped justify) the idea that so long as people don’t claim they’re authentic they can sell or do what they like, whether they have a right to do so or not, and regardless of whether whatever tribe they’re appropriating from finds it offensive or not. So people carrying on with their fake smudging ceremonies, or selling their fake smudging sticks that are prepared in the wrong way, using herbs that are sacred to a number of Native American cultures and more than likely mixed in with other herbs that would never be used together, but hey, that’s OK cos they’re not calling it Native, right? Perhaps, if they were using those herbs because they have any significance outside of Native American cultures. Because yes, there are plenty of cases where herbs are burnt for fumigation, purification, even exorcism in other cultures through the ages. But that’s not the case when you’re using white sage or sweetgrass, is it? Regardless of what you call what you’re doing, ultimately you’re still using them because of those Native American beliefs you’re totally not appropriating.
Whatever you call it, it seems to me that you’re still appropriating from cultures that have stood up and said - time and time again - that what you’re doing is offensive to them. And that what you’re doing is hurtful and harmful. But whatevs, right? You can ignore that and carry on, because you have the privilege to do so. That’s nice, isn’t it? Good for you. At the very least the cost of the privilege is that while you carry on doing what you’re doing, there are going to be some people who aren’t going to ignore that. There are going to be people who speak out. If that offends you, well then aren’t you lucky, because in the end you’ll dismiss it as ‘asinine’ and carry on anyway. You don’t have to be a part of this discussion because you can just not join in. That’s your privilege, right? Or you could take a hint, and then you won’t feel the need to be pissed off that what people are saying includes you.
Personally? I have to wonder: How is having some basic, common decency “asinine”? Because the conversation is an indirect criticism of what you do? That’s not asinine, that’s just your problem.
And someone’s sick of “white bitches” telling you “not to use native things?” Well. I think it’s clear that it’s not just “white bitches” is it? This discussion is happening because of what indigenous people themselves are saying, and have said time and time again, and and because some non-Natives choose to listen, and choose to try and reach an understanding of these things. I guess it’s very telling that instead of engaging in civil conversation, the conversation gets reduced to insults when the people who don’t like what they hear, though.
Woof.
Reblogging because if this ^^^ does not drive the message home, then I am pretty sure nothing will.
